Don't blame me, I voted for the other guy. (Politics General)

@Shirani  
Calm down, this is a sensitive subject and getting mad will just make things worse.

@Shirani  
That still doesn’t disqualify what the US did to japanese civilians.  
I do know that WWII was not, in function, a black-and-white fight. But allied propaganda painted it as one. And look at what the US did to 226.000 unsuspecting civilians.

@neutralgrey  
They were discussing if they should surrender during that timeframe but they didn’t want to unconditionally surrender to the U.S. It wasn’t until after the declaration of war by the U.S.S.R. and the second atomic bombing that they realized that they had no choice but to surrender unconditionally lest they face the possibility of annihilation by both powers.

Whether or not Operation Downfall would habe been catastrophic, Hirohito would have surrendered due to hopelessness anyway.  
The japanese, especially civilians, weren’t all patriotic death machines.  
There were other alternatives.

@Shirani  
Plus, if they didn’t drop the bomb, Japan wouldn’t have lost their military causing them to invest in technology and we wouldn’t have Nintendo!
 
Sweet, sweet Nintendo Entertainment System.

@BadgingBadger  
When you’re comparing a country in the middle of total war against a determined and dangerous enemy  
To a bunch of religious mongoloids attacking little girls with nailbombs in the name of their bloodthirsty god and pedophile warmonger prophet,No, I don’t consider it hypocritical.

@Mr grump  
Terrorism isn’t only islamic.  
And that’s a buttload of religious insults right there, especially since they’re directed at only 0.01% of the population you’re talking about.

@BadgingBadger  
We see that with ANTIFA and BLM.

@BadgingBadger  
I’m insulting an ideology, not a person or anyone here.

@Mr grump  
No, you’re clearly insulting someone, because ideologies need adepts to be real.

@Shirani  
Wouldn’t the threat of the Russians invading their land have been enough? Seemed like the last straw, and the bombs just seemed like overkill.
 
@Cyborg_pony  
…now I’m conflicted

@BadgingBadger  
Most certainly isn’t all Islamic, especially when the biggest Terrorist of them all is Trump.
 
@Cyborg_pony  
Antifa and BLM are not terrorist organizations, they haven’t even killed anyone, at worst they’ve broken a few windows and injured some people.

@Hypnosryan  
And I’m sure that wasn’t intended to scare anyone into compliance.

@BadgingBadger  
Terrorism as a definition works only if it is against civilians and civilians only, otherwise it gets muddled with the state of war.
 
There is overlap between state of war, psychological warfare and terrorist tactics, of course. Following the power doctrines of war, it is always better to seek out swift and decisive victory than prolonged attrition war, for the purpose of utter surrender. Given that US has been relatively merciful towards all who’ve surrendered to them, I have more respect for them than others that would have been in the same position.
 
The concept of war crimes is there to minimize needless suffering and death, but there is no such thing as a clean war that will intentionally avoid all civilian death if it conflicts with victory and there never will. The only clean victory will always be the promise and threat of utter destruction of all civilian life without ever launching a single attack, which is only achieved through empirical knowledge. The promise that people will be spared and able to hide leaves room for insurgency, therefore the negotiation of surrender have to be the only good option over all others. I’ll take the flashing, temporary burn over the slow grind of generational lasting warfare any time. The only thing that ever needs to be considered if a war is justified and it has a simple achievable goal, once done, there are no rules thereafter.
 
This thread went surprsingly dark, all of a sudden.

@neutralgrey  
You have to remember their fanaticism and the fact that their code of bushido specified that surrender was dishonorable. When you mix them together you can see why they wouldn’t surrender until their backs were fully against the wall. Imagine if testing the Atomic Bomb was a failure….

@PonyPon  
Why is that inherently a bad thing?

@Hypnosryan  
“especially when the biggest Terrorist of them all is Trump.” that is libel right there.

@Hypnosryan  
They cause chaos, attack people burn cities then have lists for demands to be met with compliance or they continue.
 
Terrorism, isn’t just killing. It’s trying to create a start of fear. A “do as we say, or we’ll come for you” type.
 
Plus; They’ve come close. Very close. I would almost bet someone has died, and the legacy media just covered it up as they often do.
 
@Hypnosryan  

 
Whoa, whoa. Back up! Did you just admit to being fine with fear mongering?

@Shirani  
Well Trump hasn’t used the bomb… yet.

@Mr grump  
first problem: Japan was no longer a real threat, the reason the US wanted them to surrender to them was to avoid the Soviets getting more territory,
 
second it’s the same god for all 3 Aberhamic religions, they are all just variable levels of hipsters about which books in the series are and are not canon,
 
third most christian monarchs married kids too, and republicans insist on protecting laws that allow people to marry kids as young as 13 years old because the bible endorses it, the pedo card is not a construct of any one religion it’s a major part of the common baseline patriarchal society, that 99% of the world is based on, and get’s torn down only as more moderate beliefs come into play as part of the narutal human march to equality and social justice,
 
fourth and finally, much of what is wrong in the middle east is mostly European colonialism’s fault for fucking them over along with most of what is now the third world, and setting them back centuries of progress and exploiting them even now, I.E. we have ISIS because the people don’t want to force their government to move away from Oil so we can deal with Saudi Arabia, every time you fill up you gas tank the money you save is covered in the blood of the victims of terrorism,

@Hypnosryan  
I doubt you’d be perfectly fine with a bunch of right-wingers smashing buildings and threatening to beat the shit out of people to promote their own ideological goals, just so long as no one got hurt.

@neutralgrey  
As uncomfortable as it makes you feel, it is nothing but a numbers game. Reality is numbers. 226,000 civilians is a lot, but 42,000,000 dwarfs it. We didn’t end 226,000 lives. The Japanese did that - and millions more - when they attacked Pearl Harbor.
 
We didn’t kill 226,000 people.  
We saved 41.8 million
 

 
@BadgingBadger  
Bombing fleets and such would not have demonstrated the full power of the weapon.
 
You cut the psychological effect of this weapon to less than half, endangering all the 42 million it could’ve save.
 
And the fact that we’re no longer comparing the US to any other key major player in the war, having established the moral supremacy, but are now holding it to a standard of perfection, speaks volumes on how moral it is.
 

 
@neutralgrey  
No. Okinawa. Read about it. Admitting you’re defeated only works if you’d accept defeat over death.
 
The Imperial Japanese, every time we shot one of their thousands of planes down or fought over dozens of islands, proved they would rather commit mass suicide by charging a barbed wire fence in a POW camp than admit defeat (literally happened). They would literally rather die than surrender, was what we saw at every single battle, every pilot who didn’t bring a parachute (and yes, they were common tech, literally everyone used them except the IJ), every kamikaze pilot, and every civilian they compelled to suicide rather than fall into our hands.
 
Think of that Anime protagonist who walks into his death rather than back down. Basically that.
 

 
@Hypnosryan  
Okay, you’re not supporting that claim and you’re ignoring all I’ve said. Goodnight.

@Thanotos Omega  
except during biblical times the consummation of marriage didn’t happen until they came of age as in adulthood which was 16-18 at the time. There were also limits on how old the groom could be to marry a younger bride which was why so many kids were betrothed closer to their age group. Keep in mind that life expectancy was lower during those days.

@Thanotos Omega  

@zerowinger66  
My thoughts exactly.